| 7 MAR 2003 at 4:09am |
sennebecGuild Master
Posts : 3334
Joined: 15 NOV 2004
Location: US, maine
Status : Offline | i hear what you're sayin' monkeybone...
and i tend to agree with you you ... but...
i think the independants are doing a great job of bring us quality games and ...
it's also a matter of weeding out the the run-of-the-mill in search of the exceptional... not an easy task...
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| 7 MAR 2003 at 4:59am |
SirDaveGuild Master
Posts : 4940
Joined: 17 OCT 2002
Location: US
Status : Offline | The question isn't 'Are we just making do?'
It's [size=18]Are we just making doo-doo?
The future ain't what it used to be!
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| 7 MAR 2003 at 7:06am |
| Deleted User | Or "are THEY just making doo-doo?"!
Sen - get what you mean, but the independents don't have the financial backing (other than Jonathon at XXV Productions, it seems!) to produce something on the level to which I'm expecting.
I've tried the KQ2 remake, but the original holds a dear place in my heart (believe it) and I preferred it in all it's blocky crapness... Darkfall was great!
Would you suggest any that'd live up to my expectations of high production values? :-/
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| 7 MAR 2003 at 10:17am |
StammerGuild Master
Posts : 3894
Joined: 5 JAN 2003
Status : Online | Originally Posted By monkeybone (7 MAR 2003 7:05am)
Or "are THEY just making doo-doo?"!
Sen - get what you mean, but the independents don't have the financial backing (other than Jonathon at XXV Productions, it seems!) to produce something on the level to which I'm expecting.
I've tried the KQ2 remake, but the original holds a dear place in my heart (believe it) and I preferred it in all it's blocky crapness... Darkfall was great!
Would you suggest any that'd live up to my expectations of high production values? :-/
So this means you didn't like King's quest 2 remake ???
I am a big fun of King's quest series but i still haven't played the remake! So is it good???...
Resistance is not futile, we're gonna win this thing, humankind is too good, we're not a bunch of under-achievers! We're gonna stand up, and we're gonna be human beings. We're going to get fired up about the real things, the things that matter! Creativity, and the dynamic human spirit that refuses to submit.
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| 7 MAR 2003 at 3:11pm |
| Deleted User | I liked it, didn't really play it long... had other games to play. It's fun.
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| 7 MAR 2003 at 7:06pm |
| Deleted User | Originally Posted By dombrewer (5 MAR 2003 9:55pm)
I see where Death-Ray's coming from here -
Isn't this about nostalgia primarily? ....................
I do not agree with the nostalgia thing. I have only been playing adv. games since 1996, so not enough time for it to be nostalgic. Like I said earlier, it's only natural to look for the next high to equal or exceed the first. However, it's not going to happen. This applies to everything we humans do, ie. drugs, thrill seekers, sex (well not always, this can get better), gambling, adventure games, etc... Those first couple games that got you hooked in the genre just can't be repeated. Think back to those games and the feeling you got when you solved a puzzle, and in those days without a walkthrough. Also, graphic adventures were fairly new which made them even more exciting, esp. when accompanied with good sound effects. For me this was "The Dig". I am a SciFi nut and the opening sequence just blew me away. I stayed up every night (very late) for a few weeks and thought about nothing else, when I wasn't playing, until I finished it. Then came Myst and Zork Nemesis, I was hooked but good. I just can't get that feeling anymore. It's natural. I find myself more enjoying other genre games like System Shock 2 and the Thief series. I still enjoy adventure games but think developers are always lacking one important aspect in the new games: ie. either good story, graphics, use of sound, use of in game animation, needless dialouge, way too much wandering, etc., etc., etc. For newcomers this is okay but for veteran game players, we need all these latter things to work together. Well thats my two cents. Hope you all can relate to this.
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| 7 MAR 2003 at 8:18pm |
SirDaveGuild Master
Posts : 4940
Joined: 17 OCT 2002
Location: US
Status : Offline | Death-Ray:
I get your main point and there's a lot of truth to what you say about that 'feeling of nostalgia'. But, I would still say that if someone was just getting into adventure gaming now as opposed to any time between, say, 1993 and 1999, they couldn't possibly experience the same level of thrill that those of us did who started during that time period. Then, you could go into any number of stores and see several AGs lined up. Now, you're hard pressed to see one or two.
The future ain't what it used to be!
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| 7 MAR 2003 at 10:00pm |
| Deleted User | I remember the excitement of going to Milton Keynes (yes, I was excited to got to Milton Keynes, OK?) and my dad buying our first CGA "portable" PC, and our first game, Space Quest 3...
Nothing will beat the sound of the 3 1/2 inch disks inside the box and the new manuals with release lists of the old Sierra titles...
Ah, the days when I wanted to play Manhunter 'cause of the scary picture of the monk-guy in the hood...
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| 8 MAR 2003 at 12:50am |
| Deleted User | The silence is deafening! It must be that The Truth is in Here!
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| 8 MAR 2003 at 10:20pm |
BelindaSchattenjger
Posts : 2093
Joined: 21 OCT 2002
Status : Online | Originally Posted By Death-Ray (5 MAR 2003 9:29pm)
is not being able to get that same feeling we got when playing those first couple of adventure games that got us hooked. Those were sweet times that can not be relived I am sorry to say.
This is true Death-Ray.......the feeling we all use to have when we first started our adventure gaming.......the excitement of hurrying to get back to your computer, to play more of that game.......not wanting to quit playing, the thrill of new puzzles and mysteries........
It's sort of like a marriage.......after a few years, the newness wears off....and we become comfortable with our partner. So.......I guess you can say, we have become comfortable with the adventure games now.....
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| 9 MAR 2003 at 3:19am |
JoGuild Master
Posts : 3313
Joined: 3 NOV 2002
Location: AU, Qld.
Status : Offline | Quite agree with Belinda and Death-Ray, you just can't re-capture the excitement of your first adventure games. Both my daughter and I used to stay up half the night, way-back-then, having turns and trying to out-do each other to solve puzzles. my husband wasn't remotely interested and still just peeps over my shoulder at times to see what's happening), and our son used to get on the phone to us talking for ages about whatever new game he was playing. I'd love to still feel that first thrill. Now you know if you are really stuck you can use a hint or walkthrough and that somehow spoils things (even if you don't use it, you still know it's there).
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| 14 MAR 2003 at 12:46pm |
judyannSorcerer Apprentice
Posts : 319
Joined: 11 OCT 2002
Status : Online | When I first started in the early 90s, the ONLY game I played I really didn't care that much for was Myst - but I finished it. Other than that, I enjoyed them all.
In the past few years, however, there have been a few games I really liked, but there have been more that I really didn't.
Why? First of all, the puzzles. Early games I played had puzzles with some kind of logic to them, even if it was kinky. So many puzzles today just don't seem to have any kind of logic.
What to do next? In earlier games, you could wander around wondering what to do next, but games today seem to build in the wandering aspect making you go back and forth to find what you need to sovle a puzzle. Almost like it was intentional to make the game seem longer.
Everything in those games seemed to work - every aspect - graphics, puzzles,characters - served the story. Too often, now, it seems the story is an excuse for graphics, puzzles and little characterization.
I am not saying that there are no good games these days, I am saying that are a lot of bad ones.
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| 14 MAR 2003 at 1:51pm |
StammerGuild Master
Posts : 3894
Joined: 5 JAN 2003
Status : Online | I can agree with you about the last thing you said
Resistance is not futile, we're gonna win this thing, humankind is too good, we're not a bunch of under-achievers! We're gonna stand up, and we're gonna be human beings. We're going to get fired up about the real things, the things that matter! Creativity, and the dynamic human spirit that refuses to submit.
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| 14 MAR 2003 at 6:24pm |
| Deleted User | Originally Posted By judyann (14 MAR 2003 12:45pm)
................................
What to do next? In earlier games, you could wander around wondering what to do next, but games today seem to build in the wandering aspect making you go back and forth to find what you need to sovle a puzzle. Almost like it was intentional to make the game seem longer.
Everything in those games seemed to work - every aspect - graphics, puzzles,characters - served the story. Too often, now, it seems the story is an excuse for graphics, puzzles and little characterization.
I am not saying that there are no good games these days, I am saying that are a lot of bad ones.
Agree with you 100% judyann. See my last post on this thread, it sounds familiar.
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| 14 MAR 2003 at 6:26pm |
| Deleted User | Sorry, next to last post.
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| 14 MAR 2003 at 11:59pm |
jamarchandSchattenjger
Posts : 1665
Joined: 10 OCT 2002
Status : Offline | Adventure games, find specifical problems, differents of other genres.
FIRST - An new adventure, need a real new plot, new concept....new puzzles (the ideal, at least), so....When a studio launch a new adventure, this game need to do different things of the past ones. Note that, this fact, force two interesting things - In one hand, the studios work under pressure to create new concepts and original scripts....And the positive aspect is - Well, this variety of concepts, can help adventure games to be eternally "mutant and live". An adventure concept, force the genre to evolution and constant new ways, because this game stylle don't depend exclusivelly of computer techonology, but depends principally of the developers capacity to create new ways to tell the story.
Concluding - This fact give to adventure genre the PRIVILEDGE OF PERPETUATION. Any other genre have this priviledge!
Racing and sports principally, depends exclusivelly of technology improvement, so.....for exemple: FIFA serie is predestinate to stagnation in the future, because, in some years, the computer technology will be so developed, that any other improvement couldn't be added to post versions. This occur, exactly because the sports, racing and pure action ones is under these conditions.
So, at the same time, that adventure games have imense difficulty to mantain evolution and power in the market, they are guaranteed like "perpetual and live genre", exactly like a movie. Directors create new stories day after day. Some bad and repetitives, but others good and inovatives.
SPORTS, RACING AND ACTION, factally will fall in to marasm, while adventure will "always"continue to give us, some good surprises.
And now, I invite you to think with me, this good question: Which studio in the future (maybe 10 years), would like to invest in a game genre that arrived at max development? A definitive game, like hipotetically, FIFA 2015 don't will promote new sales. So the market to these games, will be very bad. None studio would produce games that would be sale just one time."THE UPGRADE IS THE ESSENCE OF COMPUTER MARKET"
Perfect games, will be exactally like houses (should be bought only one time - don't need post versions....these games could entretain several generations). And the market, is hungry for NEW SALES.
So, IMHO, the better market in terms of sales in the future, is YES >>>>>>>>>ADVENTURE!
 &&&&[move]Actually playing SHIVERS and Rhem 2[/move]&&
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| 10 APR 2003 at 8:19pm |
pleto4_ryanIntergalactic Janitor
Posts : 93
Joined: 7 APR 2003
Status : Online | There are no classics at this period because we live at this period, a classic is named classic after some years.....
There are many good adventures out there. Better than the first ones....
Don't look at the past with a envy, look at it with happy remember. Past is past and future is future....
As godfather said. Evolution....
And more, do you really thing those games where so good. Or has the time left you only with good memories...
The Last Grim Journey Is Life...
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| 11 APR 2003 at 9:53am |
Hot Cross BunsIntergalactic Janitor
Posts : 25
Joined: 20 JAN 2003
Status : Online | Does anyone know what happened to the people at LucasArts & Sierra? what'd they move on to? Anyway I don't think they came out of the gate with instant classics, but did get better with more experience. I'm hoping today's gamemakers will too.
I have to say Grand Theft Auto vice city is starting to look good to me, only because of all the attention to detail that goes into the game. They have a radio station in there that plays 8 hours of music for cryin' out loud! I know that market is more profitable than AGs, but the AG makers could at least make up for it with better detail.
I liked Syberia & Post Mortem but I have to describe them as 'soulless'. There should be more incentive to care about the main characters, but there isn't. Although Kate Walker pulls off a better job than what's his face in PM.
The main characters should at least comment on the objects they see or pick up. In PM the guy sees a dead body and nothing! He sees the murder weapon and nada. Where's the emotion? He might as well be inspecting a dictionary. Dull, dull, dull...
If I got GTA Vice City would that be like going over to the dark side?
Hmmm...
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| 11 APR 2003 at 1:26pm |
| Deleted User | Beware the evil action games and their "bling bling" appearences!
We forgive you *MB starts up a game of UT2003*.
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| 11 APR 2003 at 5:34pm |
jujigatameSchattenjger
Posts : 1976
Joined: 14 FEB 2003
Status : Online | Regarding GTA3 and Vice City, just freakin get em. They're awesome. Unbelievable freedom, attention to detail, and just plain fun. Good god they're awesome. GTA3 was probably the best PC game of last year, hands down.
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| 11 APR 2003 at 5:46pm |
pleto4_ryanIntergalactic Janitor
Posts : 93
Joined: 7 APR 2003
Status : Online | Originally Posted By jujigatame (11 APR 2003 5:34pm)
GTA3 was probably the best PC game of last year.
Absolutely not....
(i liked it much but don't give it such credit...)
I prefered Mafia...That was THE game of last year....
The Last Grim Journey Is Life...
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| 11 APR 2003 at 8:54pm |
jujigatameSchattenjger
Posts : 1976
Joined: 14 FEB 2003
Status : Online | Mafia did not offer the unparalleled freedom to do whatever the hell you want that GTA did. That's what put it over the top for me.
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| 11 APR 2003 at 9:54pm |
| Deleted User | The two games are very different. The realism and story of Mafia was great, and the arcadiness of GTA3 was awesome...
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| 12 APR 2003 at 6:04pm |
pleto4_ryanIntergalactic Janitor
Posts : 93
Joined: 7 APR 2003
Status : Online | Originally Posted By monkeybone (11 APR 2003 9:54pm)
The two games are very different. The realism and story of Mafia was great, and the arcadiness of GTA3 was awesome...
I agree, i liked the freedom of GTA3 and still i am....
But Mafia truly IS a game....It's story, cimenatic cutscenes, it's realism (so true), it's so clever ideas and every "mission" being totally different from the others and so revolution...who can forget some levels...like the fight at the art museem, or the chase on the roofs of the buildings, or the fight in the chursh where you can use the coffin as a shield, or the "mission" at the rainy night at the house out of town, or the robbery or...etc
Each and one different from anything we have seen, and all that packed in wonderful grafics a, sound and music...what else does anybody wants?
The Last Grim Journey Is Life...
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